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Odd Plus Four

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8:35 pm
Mar 31, 2010

Andrew

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posts 55

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Post edited 7:39 pm — Mar 31, 2010 by Andrew

This is unusual. A Plus four for sale on eBay but it has no brass lugs, doesn’t have the lovely brass look Guvnor badge on the cross bar and has a Cane Creek Time Trial brake lever.

What’s going on ?

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Pashley-.….500wt_1030

9:43 pm
Mar 31, 2010

Duchy Wheeler

Cornwall. UK

Regular

posts 395

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Andrew, I’ve just taken a look at this and agree it does seem all very odd! Would Pashley really produce and release for sale a ‘Plus Four’ limited edition without issue number plate and no brass lugs? Very strange if it is the case, as it sadly undermines the whole concept of limited editions!

Confused Safe riding, Geoff.

9:44 pm
Mar 31, 2010

The Cycling Photogra

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Andrew said:

This is unusual. A Plus four for sale on eBay but it has no brass lugs, doesn’t have the lovely brass look Guvnor badge on the cross bar and has a Cane Creek Time Trial brake lever.

What’s going on ?

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Pashley-.….500wt_1030

Hmmmm, a bounder trying his luck no less.

10:00 pm
Mar 31, 2010

jseely

Rhode Island, USA

Regular

posts 42

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Gentlemen,

What does the seller mean by “Pashley Guvnor 4 speed one off” factory bike. Pashley now does one offs of their limited (very) additions?

I’m confused.…. but for a Yank that’s not unusual ;-)

Jonathan

10:10 pm
Mar 31, 2010

jseely

Rhode Island, USA

Regular

posts 42

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Just took another look. Could it be possible that the seller really bought a single or 3 speed and made the modifications. That might explain the lack of brass lugs, “brass” sticker and what appears to be no serial or issue plate on the head tube. Thinking out loud.

1:53 am
Apr 1, 2010

jseely

Rhode Island, USA

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posts 42

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I got the skinny on the odd Plus Four. I asked the seller on ebay how he came to have the bike and he said

“Hi, I was told all the 4 speed were for the USA old or earmarked for stores this was one. I was told many times the could not sell me one but they were told of my plans to enter an historic race in Italy and agreed this special one off. The bike is one of the 50. My plans were to produce some publicity for pashley. As I mentioned in the 14 weeks to build the bike I changed my job and can not train for the race as I travel most of the week. Paul”

So that’s it.…. I guess!?!

5:21 am
Apr 1, 2010

Calif Guv

Santa Cruz, California

Regular

posts 40

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Gentlemen,

Not only is this odd, but I think it is an impostor! It simply looks like a revamped standard-issue Guv’nor. Did I just write “standard-issue”? So sorry, gentlemen! It seems to me likely that this was a converted model in order to take sales–orders–on the authentic item–the Plus 4. That would explain why they could not sell it.

Living in Santa Cruz, a short 30 miles from the epicenter Silicon Valley where E-Bay resides, and understanding the E-Bay phenomenon (or spectacle it has become), I am pretty certain this is not the real deal. It is well known in these parts that E-Bay has been co-opted, or corrupted, by many unscrupulous types and on-line retailers. Hey, it’s the wild West after all! There are no durable standards of integrity; it’s caveat emptor X 2! My two bits worth…

Gary

9:04 am
Apr 1, 2010

Duchy Wheeler

Cornwall. UK

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posts 395

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‘Curiosity’ got the better of me and I phoned Pashley this morning about this cycle and they confirmed all the 50 Pashley produced Plus Fours would have been numbered and have had brass lugs. So this looks like its an impostor. Pashley said they would follow up and may report to Ebay.

9:47 am
Apr 1, 2010

Dogbreath

North Herts, England

Regular

posts 62

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Correct me if i’m wrong but i thought it was hard to get hold of the Sachs + Speed drive running gear.

I’d suggest the Plus Four was made for a non-uk market where you can get away with a pure coater brake and thats it…slightly spoils the lines having the front brake lever and cable.

Coaster brakes scare me lol

Plus Four no. 4 :)

11:19 am
Apr 1, 2010

Duchy Wheeler

Cornwall. UK

Regular

posts 395

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Fellow wheelers.….….. according to Pashley only 50 were made, for worldwide sales. The Sachs Duomatic hubs were/are ‘new old stock’, so they are still around and can be sourced, the Schlumpf Speed Drive is also currently available. So, I conclude this cycle is spurious. Made up from the various components, using a 20.5″ single speed as the base, also the bell and brake lever are not original equipment. I concur with Calif Guv ‘Caveat Emptor’

Safe riding, Geoff.

10:00 pm
Apr 1, 2010

jmkd

Admin

posts 114

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Gentlemen, an intriguing story, and well investigated. Let’s see how this one pans out…

1:16 pm
Apr 5, 2010

GODFATHER186

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I had also seen this on E-BAY and asked the seller the same question..“Is this a PLUS FOUR sir?”..I had the same relpy,It was made for the race by Pashley and not of the one’s sold.…why would I ask..because I am the owner of 01–50 Plus four..“limited edition”..I work very hard and I payed alot,I wanted to know if there was another even more “limited” piece out there.…you can purchase the drive system and hub’s and build your own.I have had some minor issue’s and a quick call to pashley and it was taken care of,there customer service is top notch!..

in any case,It was a nice cycle,very stealthy!…and I am sure someone will enjoy it never the less…( I had thought of purchasing it myself..HAHA:) but why have two bike’s with the same system??..

Happy trail’s!

Keith

10:07 pm
Apr 6, 2010

jmkd

Admin

posts 114

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A follow up of sorts:

I had the great fortune today to enter the renowned Bobbin Bicycles of Islington. I cannot recommend the experience enough, but more on that later.

In conversation with an upstanding gentleman who was also the owner of a brass lug– and numberplate-less Plus Four — it was courteously explained to me how this rarest of circumstances came about.

Rest assured it was legitimate (in this case at least) yet rare as hen’s teeth. And yours truly will acquire some photos and forge an explanatory article as soon as he can.

James

6:01 pm
Apr 7, 2010

Duchy Wheeler

Cornwall. UK

Regular

posts 395

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Post edited 6:52 pm — Apr 20, 2010 by Duchy Wheeler

Keith & James.….…..sadly this is all turning out to be a bit of a farrago, undermining the ‘limited edition’ ethos. Seems the Plus Four isn’t quite what it was tourted to be, along with its premium price! .….…..safe riding one and all, Geoff.

3:23 am
Jul 13, 2011

slow-rider

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Hi to everyone on the post.

2:00 pm
Jul 13, 2011

Texamps

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Hi,

When I got my Guvnor 3 spd in May I asked the distributor/dealer here in Canada if they had any Plus 4 bikes left, said sold the last G4 in April.

Sales rep said (He is also the buyer for all the Pashley bikes in Canada) if I wanted the same bike that he could get me one custom made. He told me Pashley would make a custom one for them, I did not like the 4–6 month wait so did not ask anymore question about it & got the G3 for $1600.

Not sure if Pashley would have just put the P4 on a standard frame? He seemed laid back about getting the custom bike made, seems they have done it before?

PS: They brought in 3 LTD Guvnor P4’s in Canada.

Tony

2:52 pm
Jul 13, 2011

slow-rider

North Yorkshire

New

posts 2

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Post edited 4:45 pm — Jul 16, 2011 by slow-rider

10:18 pm
Jul 31, 2011

slow-rider

North Yorkshire

New

posts 2

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Hi All

I cannot seem to get the hang of posting my message, not just a slow-rider but also slow with computers, so here goes for the third time!

I am the lucky owner or the said 4 speed Guvnor. I first saw the Guvnor late 2009 in Evens Cycles YORK. It was a single speed and I would have purchased it there and then if I had’nt had my sensible hat on, impulse buy and all that!

The seed was sown and I started to research the model.

Having seen the second time the Guvnor was listed I spoke to Paul who was selling it and decided to meet as he seemed genuine to me, just to confirm what he had told me and with my sensible hat on again I checked with Edinburgh Cycles where it was purchased from originally.

The cycle was never listed as a Plus Four and so new what to expect

He supplied me with the “tea” in the tool tin and more importantly an original purchase receipt with the order date (and deposit paid) and delivery date with final payment.

Stated at the order date in July are the words Pashley Guvnor 4-speed Custom spec Buckingham black 20.5″.

Delivery date was 14th sept 09.

I have had this beautiful machine since april last year and have no reason to doubt that it is anything but factory built.

I love the fact it has only one cable, clean lines and always attracts glances.

I did contact Pashley prior to purchase as I had a frame No but they just said “they do not keep records on them” I could have maybe more specific about the frame usage but I think they thought I meant the original purchaser.

I do just wonder how many in this spec there are about.

11:51 am
Aug 1, 2011

Duchy Wheeler

Cornwall. UK

Regular

posts 395

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slow-rider.….….….leading on from my earlier comments in this topic, I have gleaned some more information which leads me to speculate the following:

I know Pashley had some production issues related to the brass plating on the Plus Four, so they may well have made some non-plated examples, maybe specials for cycle trade proprietors, so using the term “Four Speed Custom” would avoid undermining the limited edition Plus Four.

I know that Pashley produced a 24½” frame Guv’nor for the owner of Bobbin Bicycles, with the Sachs Duomatic rear hub sans the Schlumpf Speed Drive, I spied it at this years Tweed Run, so factory made one off Guv’nor’s are around.

Safe rides ‘One & All’.

DW.

5:28 pm
Dec 3, 2011

Tom Morris

Guest